16V 2.0 Pickup lives, sort of... Need help ASAP..

[area53 at validpath.com (Jeff Toomasson)]

Well - now that's not very polite...Since when are you offended about my
reference to one of the list's most consistent truths??

It's all in good fun. Sorry if I struck a nerve.

JT
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Patrick Bureau" <ats@longcoeur.com>
To: "'Jeff Toomasson'" <area53@validpath.com>; "'Brian McGarvey'"
<brianm@earendel.org>; "'David Utley'" <mr.utility@highstream.net>
Cc: "'scirocco list'" <scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
Sent: Sunday, April 18, 2004 9:36 PM
Subject: RE: 16V 2.0 Pickup lives, sort of... Need help ASAP..


> Oh bite me Jeff.
>
> -
> ATS - Patrick Bureau - http://ats.longcoeur.com -
> A1 eBay Sales: http://tinyurl.com/22e5b
>
>
> ->-----Original Message-----
> ->From: scirocco-l-bounces@scirocco.org
> ->[mailto:scirocco-l-bounces@scirocco.org] On Behalf Of Jeff Toomasson
> ->Sent: Sunday, April 18, 2004 6:54 PM
> ->To: Brian McGarvey; David Utley
> ->Cc: 'scirocco list'
> ->Subject: Re: 16V 2.0 Pickup lives, sort of... Need help ASAP..
> ->
> ->Brian - Did Patrick hi-jack your computer??  It's only so
> ->often that someone conjures up spelling mistakes that butcher
> ->up a sentence to the point it's complete void of
> ->understandability...  :p
> ->
> ->(ducking) JT
> ->----- Original Message -----
> ->From: "Brian McGarvey" <brianm@earendel.org>
> ->To: "David Utley" <mr.utility@highstream.net>
> ->Cc: "Jeff Toomasson" <area53@validpath.com>; "'scirocco list'"
> -><scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
> ->Sent: Sunday, April 18, 2004 1:53 PM
> ->Subject: Re: 16V 2.0 Pickup lives, sort of... Need help ASAP..
> ->
> ->
> ->> how to find TDC is some ham fist put your flywheel on wrong
> ->w/ an IMPACT
> ->> gun, and a drill.
> ->>
> ->>
> ->> find a long implent either a wooden dowel or the long
> ->phillips that comes
> ->> in the craftsman screwdriver kit.
> ->> put it in the #1 clyn hole.. it should be free and wiggle a
> ->fair bit. the
> ->> scredriver  is nice cause it cant fall in, but it hazardous
> ->cause its
> ->> metal.
> ->>
> ->> THIS IS ONLY FOR A 16V motor..
> ->> THIS IS ONLY FOR A 16V motor..
> ->> THIS IS ONLY FOR A 16V motor..
> ->> IMPORTANT: only HAND crank the motor.
> ->> ONLY HAND CRANK THE MOTOR!!! in case anybody out there missed this.
> ->>
> ->> and then put your 19mm on the crank (youve already got the
> ->spark plugs
> ->> out). and carefully turn the motor over untill you see the
> ->object come up.
> ->> you will see that it comes up, stops, and goes back down.
> ->> when it is near the top look down at the lower t-belt cover and the
> ->> harmoic balancer pulley there is a tick mark. line that and
> ->that arrow up
> ->> on the plastic cover (not as precise as the TDC mark on
> ->theflywheel). Now
> ->> that object in the sparkplug hole  can be remove and put
> ->back in your tool
> ->> box.
> ->>
> ->> now go look again at the flywheel. you'll prolly see the
> ->dot and hack in
> ->> it now, its really really hard to screw up putting the
> ->flywheel on. The
> ->> bolt holes are not symmetric. use a flashlight.
> ->>
> ->> Now check the dist. the rotor should basically point right
> ->at the tick
> ->> mark on the sealing rim of the dizzy.
> ->> Brian
> ->>
> ->>
> ->> On Sun, 18 Apr 2004, David Utley wrote:
> ->>
> ->> > Alright, I see what you are saying with regards to the
> ->dist. issue, and
> ->I will
> ->> > take the flywheel issue into account.  If you are right about the
> ->flywheel,
> ->> > then I am at a loss as to how to make sure I am at TDC.  BTW, the
> ->harmonic
> ->> > balancer is off slightly as well, is that keyed, or can
> ->it be improperly
> ->> > installed too?  :-(
> ->> >
> ->> > I did take your suggestion, and began to disassemble the
> ->top end so that
> ->I
> ->> > could time the cams properly.  Don is off on errands, and
> ->I am left here
> ->> > scratching my head.  I have a Golf 16V Bentley to advise
> ->me, but if the
> ->info.
> ->> > is there, I cannot find it...  To the point---How do I
> ->adjust the timing
> ->of the
> ->> > cams?  I am afraid to begin to loosen the caps w/o
> ->specific instruction,
> ->I
> ->> > remember reading somewhere someone lost a Shrick cam
> ->because he did not
> ->tighten
> ->> > the caps down in the correct order.  That may be apples
> ->to my oranges,
> ->but I
> ->> > would rather be cautious than fool-hardy...  The marks on
> ->the cams were
> ->indeed
> ->> > off, and not facing each other...
> ->> >
> ->> > I apologize for the hand-holding...  :-)
> ->> >
> ->> > Thanks very much for any and all suggestions..
> ->> >
> ->> > Cheers?
> ->> >    David Utley
> ->> >
> ->> > Quoting Jeff Toomasson <area53@validpath.com>:
> ->> >
> ->> > > The flywheel can actually go on opposite of what it's
> ->supposed to if
> ->the
> ->> > > dowel pins have been removed previously by some
> ->hack...Also, some
> ->> > > aftermarket flywheels are not marked (though it seems
> ->you don't have
> ->this
> ->> > > issue).
> ->> > >
> ->> > > With regards to the second distro installation config,
> ->look at the
> ->distro
> ->> > > location with it removed - you should see four bolt
> ->holes as opposed
> ->to two.
> ->> > > Install the distro without the bolts and without quite
> ->engaging the
> ->cam.
> ->> > > Rotate it so you get an idea of the two fastening
> ->config's. You'll
> ->just have
> ->> > > to experiment with each pair once you start running.
> ->I'm 85% confident
> ->that
> ->> > > this is your issue as I had to deal with this the first
> ->time I did my
> ->2L
> ->> > > swap...
> ->> > >
> ->> > > FWIW - I still don't understand why there was a second set put
> ->there...
> ->> > >
> ->> > > G/L - Jeff
> ->> > > ----- Original Message ----- 
> ->> > > From: "David Utley" <mr.utility@highstream.net>
> ->> > > To: "Jeff Toomasson" <area53@validpath.com>
> ->> > > Cc: "'scirocco list'" <scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
> ->> > > Sent: Sunday, April 18, 2004 12:12 PM
> ->> > > Subject: Re: 16V 2.0 Pickup lives, sort of... Need help ASAP..
> ->> > >
> ->> > >
> ->> > > > No, not trite...  I have not played with the 16Vs
> ->nearly as much as
> ->their
> ->> > > high-
> ->> > > > flow challenged brothers, but I am learning...  :-)
> ->> > > >
> ->> > > > More comments/questions below...
> ->> > > >
> ->> > > > Quoting Jeff Toomasson <area53@validpath.com>:
> ->> > > >
> ->> > > > > Dave -
> ->> > > > >
> ->> > > > > This may sound trite, but if you're at all
> ->suspicious about the
> ->timing,
> ->> > > I'd
> ->> > > > > do each timing setup over from scratch so you can
> ->eliminate that
> ->from
> ->> > > the
> ->> > > > > equation. Since you're not the person who asembled
> ->the setup in
> ->the
> ->> > > first
> ->> > > > > place, I would recommend this even more. All the
> ->way to remove the
> ->> > > timing
> ->> > > > > belt cover and re-checking the marks...yes, you
> ->should check the
> ->cam
> ->> > > timing
> ->> > > > > too!  sorry... :)
> ->> > > > >
> ->> > > > > Couple things to check (which you may already have):
> ->> > > > >
> ->> > > >
> ->> > > >
> ->> > > > > 1) Ensure your TDC is true and not for #4
> ->> > > >
> ->> > > > I think we have done this, by using the -0- mark on
> ->the flywheel.
> ->THe
> ->> > > > flywheels on the the 16Vs are the same as 8Vs in that
> ->they can only
> ->go on
> ->> > > one
> ->> > > > way, right?  In other words, if I check for TDC by
> ->using #1 piston
> ->> > > movement,
> ->> > > > and aligned the -0- on the flywheel to the mark on
> ->the bell-housing
> ->at the
> ->> > > same
> ->> > > > time, I would indeed be at TDC, correct?
> ->> > > >
> ->> > > > > 2) There are two arrangements that the distro can
> ->be screwed in to
> ->allow
> ->> > > > > further adjustment. Try the other and leave the distro a tad
> ->loose.
> ->> > > While
> ->> > > > > you have buddy cranking the engine (or running),
> ->rotate the distro
> ->until
> ->> > > you
> ->> > > > > "find the groove" where it's running its best.
> ->> > > >
> ->> > > > I am not sure I understand this, but my mechanic
> ->friend prolly will.
> ->I
> ->> > > will
> ->> > > > show it to him and see if he understands...
> ->> > > >
> ->> > > > Thanks for the help...
> ->> > > >
> ->> > > > David Utley
> ->> > > >
> ->> > > > > ----- Original Message ----- 
> ->> > > > > From: "David Utley" <mr.utility@highstream.net>
> ->> > > > > Cc: "'scirocco list'" <scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
> ->> > > > > Sent: Saturday, April 17, 2004 10:41 PM
> ->> > > > > Subject: OT: 16V 2.0 Pickup lives, sort of... Need
> ->help ASAP..
> ->> > > > >
> ->> > > > >
> ->> > > > > >
> ->> > > > > >
> ->> > > > > > Hello all,
> ->> > > > > >   I actually have some 16V qyestions to ask, wooohhoooo!
> ->> > > > > >   The vehicle in question is an '82 p/up with a
> ->Passat 2.0 16V
> ->and
> ->> > > > > Scirocco
> ->> > > > > > CIS-E FI...
> ->> > > > > >   Okay, my friend Don and I got the pickup to
> ->run, despite the
> ->P.O.s
> ->> > > best
> ->> > > > > > attempts to put the thing together wrong.  The
> ->thing would start
> ->and
> ->> > > run,
> ->> > > > > > but you really had to work with the throttle to get it to
> ->accelerate,
> ->> > > and
> ->> > > > > > the sucker is SO LOUD...  Since it would not
> ->accelerate easily
> ->at all,
> ->> > > we
> ->> > > > > > began to look at the timing.  After removing #1
> ->spark plug and
> ->> > > checking
> ->> > > > > for
> ->> > > > > > TDC (esp since the marks at the flywheel could
> ->not be seen), we
> ->saw
> ->> > > that
> ->> > > > > the
> ->> > > > > > cam was retarded by one tooth.  We fixed that and
> ->reinstalled,
> ->and ran
> ->> > > it
> ->> > > > > > up.  It ran much better, but it still was not
> ->right.  We then
> ->checked
> ->> > > the
> ->> > > > > > timing, and saw that the dist. could not be
> ->advanced any more
> ->because
> ->> > > > > there
> ->> > > > > > was no more room left in the attachment slots.
> ->Also, the timing
> ->mark
> ->> > > on
> ->> > > > > the
> ->> > > > > > cam gear is not -precisely-pointed at the mark on
> ->the valve
> ->cover.  It
> ->> > > is
> ->> > > > > > retarded  about half a tooth.  These two things lead us to
> ->believe
> ->> > > that
> ->> > > > > the
> ->> > > > > > cams themselves are not timed properly.  Does
> ->that seem like
> ->what is
> ->> > > > > > happening here?  The trouble that we now
> ->experience is that the
> ->thing
> ->> > > > > still
> ->> > > > > > does not want to rev like it really should.  It
> ->still sputters a
> ->bit,
> ->> > > esp.
> ->> > > > > > if you mash on it from an idler...
> ->> > > > > >
> ->> > > > > > Don wanted me to ask you all if this was worth
> ->the effort of
> ->re-timing
> ->> > > the
> ->> > > > > > cams...  I think the answer is yes, but I too am
> ->interested in
> ->what
> ->> > > all
> ->> > > > > you
> ->> > > > > > think needs to be done...
> ->> > > > > >
> ->> > > > > > Any answers are appreciated, especially the quick
> ->ones, as we
> ->will be
> ->> > > > > > attempting to put things right starting noon
> ->Sunday, central
> ->time...
> ->> > > > > Thanks
> ->> > > > > > very much for your time!
> ->> > > > > >
> ->> > > > > > Cheers!
> ->> > > > > >    David Utley
> ->> > > > > >
> ->> > > > > > PS--  A first!  Although I have 7 VWs, I will for
> ->the first time
> ->have
> ->> > > 1.5
> ->> > > > > > running vehicles, woooooo-stinking-hooooo!  :)
> ->> > > > > >
> ->> > > > > >
> ->> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> ->> > > > > > Scirocco-l mailing list
> ->> > > > > > Scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> ->> > > > > > http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l
> ->> > > > >
> ->> > > > >
> ->> > > >
> ->> > > >
> ->> > > >
> ->> > > > David Utley
> ->> > > > -----------
> ->> > > > Cable Volkswagen
> ->> > > > 405-470-3129
> ->> > > > 1-800-522-6793
> ->> > >
> ->> > >
> ->> >
> ->> >
> ->> >
> ->> > David Utley
> ->> > -----------
> ->> > Cable Volkswagen
> ->> > 405-470-3129
> ->> > 1-800-522-6793
> ->> >
> ->> > _______________________________________________
> ->> > Scirocco-l mailing list
> ->> > Scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> ->> > http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l
> ->> >
> ->>
> ->> -- 
> ->> -------------------------------------------------------------
> ->> Brian
> ->> 88 16v $2004 GRM challenge car http://www.grmotorsports.com
> ->> 84 0v Next years car? mid engine... maybe we'll see
> ->> 82 0v Black 16v kit --parts
> ->> 82 2.0L Topless bunny -- Knock Ignition and bigger clutch. next.
> ->> 90 90q20v doing daily driver duty.
> ->> 91 VFR750F everybody needs a 11-12 sec vehicle.
> ->>
> ->> Contact method. Email me for AIM, ICQ, YahooIM, IRC, etc.
> ->> -------------------------------------------------------------
> ->
> ->
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