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Re: Audio nuts only
Ok fair enough but not many people wish to hack their door panels or even fit
custom panels in order to obtain a set up like yours. Taking the standard door
apertures with 6*4 which if i read correctly the original mail from William is
using a comprimise has to be made between soundstage/depth/volume and the only
way without changing the apertures is to use rear speakers.
Whilst i appreciate this is not ideal, for everyday use it is fine and i have
no intention of entering any competitions for any aspect of in-car stereo.
In an ideal world i would follow the route you have taken but the prohibitive
cost in the UK of custom panels and high end car hi-fi not to mention our
appalling amount of car theft make the value of such a set up dubious here.(i.e.
approaching the cars value and thus uninsurable)
Just as a point the cost of my front end set up is approxiamately a third more
than the rear but because i use the stock apertures in the front (with seperate
tweeters) i require 6*9 in the rear to provide the extra depth (40-100hz) to
complete the soundstage.
As i pointed out before this is appropriate to UK spec cars and may help anyone
who is beginning thier own custom install. A three way set up in the which is
anyway visible (in fact any visible quality hi-fi) especially in London where i
live (all my speakers other than the tweeters are hidden - fronts in standard
apertures, rears in custom "Stealth" shelf/deck which makes setting up very
hard) usually results in a short time in the theft of the vehicle or the
components with large damage.( i have had 3 break-ins and 4 lots of vandalism in
the past 18 months)
Anyway thankyou for your comments which i read with interest and you never know
my increased knowledge may well help in the future.
Andy
91Scala 8v
Mike wrote:
> I have a three way system in the front with a 6"1/2, 5"1/4, and a titanium
> 1" tweet in each door powered by a 4X50 PPI. All of this is driven by a Sony
> deck into a parabolic divider.....No actually I do not have a loss of sound
> Q in the front...but then again I do not think many peoples front stage is
> so indepth. I have seen it many times in competition when a guy will try to
> enhance the week spot of his car by boosting another area of the car. Never
> made sense to me and nor does it to judges or a RTA. Do your front sound
> stage right and don't waste power to the back. I would rather spend money on
> a good set of speakers than two ok ones and place all my money up
> front.....JMO....
>
> BTW anyone want to but a Opti 500? I need to get more power to the isoberics
> in the back 500 watts does not cut it anymore
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Andrew Holmes <aholmes@chubb.com>
> To: Mike <lerb@redrose.net>
> Cc: <bgsterling@earthlink.net>; <scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
> Sent: Friday, June 11, 1999 10:46 AM
> Subject: Re: Audio nuts only
>
> > Don't you find that without rear speakers it is very difficult to get a
> good
> > volume/bass combination bearing in mind the front aperture is 6*4 only. I
> use
> > custom Pioneer 6*4 midrange and custom 1" Pioneer tweeters running at 80hz
> + and
> > 40w per channel pure (100wRMS). I found that using just the fronts would
> give a
> > good soundstage but no depth and a lack of bass. If i allow a lower
> frequency
> > say 50hz to run through the fronts then i get depth at the expense of
> power
> > handling as the 6*4 units struggle to deliver any bass/volume combination
> and at
> > motorway speeds (85mph) the bass disappears as the road/wind/engine noises
> drown
> > it completely.
> > I appreciate the back speakers provide your back seat passengers with
> excellent
> > sound but the purpose of a quality car audio is to balance the sound
> against the
> > deficiences of the enviroment (a steel box not being the best acoustic
> platform)
> > so ideally you should centre the sound and imaging approxiamately above
> the
> > gearstick/slightly to your front and to do this including a reasonable
> (not
> > neceesarily thumping) bass will require the back speakers.
> > You are quite correct about the hatch creating a "megaphone" effect as my
> JBL
> > 6*9's can if i provoke them quite comfortably match my friends twin 10"
> > Rockfords in a box in the back of his 325i but i generally like to end my
> > journey without my ears bleeding and ringing.
> > However if you are careful in selecting your components, use decent
> cabling
> > (this is very important and can make a huge difference) and are prepared
> to
> > spend time on a careful installation and setup then you can obtain a very
> high
> > quality sound without resorting to subs.
> > In my humble opinion this can be acheived with the minimum of
> > Head Unit
> > 4 channel amp(with built in crossover)
> > 4 quality speakers
> > Good quality interconnect and speaker cables
> >
> > Lastly if you are running your'e power directly from the battery do put an
> in
> > line fuse on the cable as close to the battery as possible (mine is
> strapped to
> > the battery) which will probably save you a lot of cash in the event of
> you
> > making an error on installation or a short within the set up.
> >
> > Please note all of the above is based on my personal experience with a UK
> spec
> > vehicle and may or may not be applicable to US or other specs.
> > I hope some of the above gives some background info which maybe useful but
> a
> > word of warning. Once you start upgrading the in car audio you are taking
> the
> > first step on a path where every upgrade will show up the weakest link in
> your
> > system thus prompting another upgrade and so on and so forth
> >
> > Enjoy
> > Andy
> > 91 Scala 8v
> >
> >
> > Mike wrote:
> >
> > > Well as far as the ba ck speakers get rid of them...a good system only
> > > eliminates sounds from behind you anyways...I like to think of it this
> > > way...Where do you hear voices from? In front of you right? Well every
> > > single voice you hear from the back you wil have to over power from the
> > > front. So why have rear? Only reason to ever have rear is if you have an
> > > audiance in the back. Actually another reason would be if you were goig
> to
> > > add a center channel but it does not look like you are about to do that.
> If
> > > you don't want thump stay away from a sub altogether. I think a good set
> of
> > > speakers up front will help your sound alot but I am not sure how you
> are
> > > going to avoid thump. Our cars have whats refurred to as a megaphone
> affect
> > > with the rear hatch reflecting alot of sound off of the glass and
> actually
> > > enhancing the sound pressure forward in the cab which makes any bass
> > > produced from te rear sound like thump. I have had people ask me what
> size
> > > subs I had me when I only had part of my system installed in my car (4,5
> 1/4
> > > Mb Quarts in the rear deck before I knew better than to put them there).
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: Brad Sterling <bgsterling@earthlink.net>
> > > To: <scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
> > > Sent: Thursday, June 10, 1999 12:21 PM
> > > Subject: RE: Audio nuts only
> > >
> > > > As long as this is a thread for newbie questions...
> > > >
> > > > I'm wanting to add a small subwoofer and amp to the stock system in my
> 16V
> > > > for a little for power (unh! Unh! Unh! (in your best Tim Allen
> voice)).
> > > > From my research, it sounds like I need a 4 channel amp with low
> level
> > > > inputs (so I can connect the speaker wires in) and low/high
> crossovers.
> > > > The idea is send the front speaker wires into the amp, two channels
> out
> > > > through a low filter to the front speakers and two channels bridged
> > > through
> > > > a high filter to the subwoofer. The end result should be the front
> > > > speakers handle the midrange/treble duties and the subwoofer handle
> the
> > > > bass. Actually, now that I put this in writing, what do I do with the
> > > rear
> > > > speakers? If I connect them to the same channels as the front
> speakers, I
> > > > lose fader function and if I connect them to the subwoofer channels,
> I'll
> > > > have the wrong filter in place. Okay, I give up. How can I put some
> more
> > > > power through the stock system without creating a car that thumps?
> Should
> > > > I just get an amplified bass tube and some inline low filters for the
> > > > speakers?
> > > >
> > > > -Brad
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: William J Erikson [SMTP:williamjosiah@juno.com]
> > > > Sent: Wednesday, June 09, 1999 12:25 PM
> > > > To: CAPTIANBR@aol.com
> > > > Cc: scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> > > > Subject: Re: Audio nuts only
> > > >
> > > > I'd say your best bet is to get an amp that has a built-in crossover
> and
> > > > is bridgeable. Crossovers filter out certain frequencies. Most
> > > > bridegeable amps with built-in crossovers and designed to be used with
> > > > one subwoofer, like you're planning on doing, so their crossovers
> filter
> > > > out high frequencies and send only the low frequencies to the
> subwoofer.
> > > > Bridgeable means you can send both channels, mono, to one subwoofer.
> > > > Usually it's done by hooking the speaker to R- and L+ or something
> like
> > > > that - it varies. Some have a "bridged" switch, like my POS Legacy.
> > > > Anyone have any opinions on Legacy, BTW? I bought one brand new for
> $80
> > > > and it worked great while it worked. 300W (150RMS), bridegeable,
> built-in
> > > > crossover, hey, sounded great. It died, but I guess that was because I
> > > > mounted it to my rear deck and my speakers were mounted there too.
> > > > Someone told me this will kill an amp. Yes? No? Sounds quite plausible
> to
> > > > me - vibration and all.
> > > > HTH! (I don't know that much about audio either, really)
> > > > -Josiah
> > > > '84 GTI
> > > > '87 QSW
> > > > '86 Golf
> > > > http://bork.hampshire.edu
> > > > self-employed VW mech
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, 9 Jun 1999 10:29:28 EDT CAPTIANBR@aol.com writes:
> > > > >I have just inherited a JBL 12" subwoofer and box. But I don't no
> what
> > > > >type
> > > > >of amp to get for it or how to hook it up in the rocco. I currently
> > > > >have six
> > > > >speakers off of a Clarion CD player. JBL componants in the front and
> > > > >pioneer
> > > > >5 1/4 in the rear. But I also have two rca outputs that are not
> being
> > > > >used,
> > > > >Shoud I use these for the subwoofer? What is a crossover and do I
> > > > >need it?
> > > > >As you can tell I don't have much experience with audio besides
> > > > >changing
> > > > >speakers. I have two rca's but only one subwoofer how will this work.
> > > > >Thanks
> > > > >in advance for any help.
> > > > >
> > > > >Brian 86 16v
> > > > >
> > > > >--
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