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ebay brake rotors--forging...



I wouldn't worry about it too much - I wouldn't be surprised if Morgan 
did many completely illogical things in their manufacturing process. 
They still build their chassis  out of wood, or at least they did the 
last time I looked.

They built 3 wheelers...

I rest my case.

Aaron in London


On 12 Mar 2004, at 00:11, David Utley wrote:

>   Yeah, you are prolly right (ouch, that hurt)...  If anything it is 
> prolly
> more akin to strss-relieving, if ANYTHING...  I will take that up with 
> him, as
> he is much like me, interested in figuring things out to an irritating
> degree...  :-)
>
> Thank you for the kid gloves...  :-)
>
>   David Utley (aka knowitsometimes)
>
> Quoting L F <rocco16v@netzero.net>:
>
>> David,
>>   A forging process is instantaneous.   And I've never heard of anyone
>> forging cast iron (those forged crankshafts are steel).
>>  Stress relieving is not the same as forging.
>> The maximum temp delta a part would see laying outside for years 
>> would be
>> about 100F.  To you and I, one hundred degrees is a bunch...to cast 
>> iron it
>> is virturally nothing and would have no effect on grain structure.  
>> You and I
>> have a working range of about 50 degrees (50deg at the coldest to 
>> about
>> 100deg at the hottest), cast iron has a working range of about 
>> 1500degF.
>>  As I said, the only metallic material in common use today that will 
>> respond
>> to just laying around is some aluminum alloys.
>>
>>  Your friend may have misunderstood or the Morgan people were having 
>> fun with
>> him....which wouldn't be unusual.
>>
>> Larry
>>   ----- Original Message -----
>>   From: David Utley
>>   To: L F ; Euroroc II
>>   Cc: Scirocco-l@scirocco.org
>>   Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 8:33 PM
>>   Subject: RE: ebay brake rotors--forging...
>>
>>
>>   Larry,
>>     I agree that forging is more effective, and quick, if it is done 
>> under
>>   pressure.  However, this is coming from Morgan, so I do not know 
>> what to
>>   say?  If they are online, I will send them an email and see if they 
>> can
>> shed
>>   some light on it?  I trust the friend with my life, so I do not 
>> think he
>> is
>>   pulling anything with me.
>>
>>     To carry through on what you just mentioned, I grant you that a 
>> used
>>   engine will work-forge (or stress-relieve as you put it), with the
>> thousands
>>   of heat cycles.  Is it not true to a lesser degree with an item 
>> that has
>>   hundreds of heat cycles with the warming of the day, and the 
>> cooling of
>> the
>>   night?  Especially considering that it is done very slowly, which 
>> as I
>>   understand it is done in some forging practices?  If you would, 
>> please
>> help
>>   me remember which ones and why slower warming/cooling is
>> effective/helpful.
>>
>>   Thanks,
>>     David Utley
>>
>>   -----Original Message-----
>>   From: L F [mailto:rocco16v@netzero.net]
>>   Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 8:19 PM
>>   To: David Utley; Euroroc II
>>   Cc: Scirocco-l@scirocco.org
>>   Subject: Re: ebay brake rotors--forging...
>>
>>   David,
>>     Somebody gave your friend some bad info.
>>   Used cast iron blocks are desireable because the heat cycling tends 
>> to
>>   stress relieve them, whereas a 'green' block still has some "moving
>> around"
>>   to do.
>>   Cast iron parts do nothing just laying around, as opposed to some 
>> aluminum
>>   alloys which DO age over time.
>>   I take that back; cast iron parts DO go through a change.....they 
>> convert
>> to
>>   iron oxide.
>>
>>   Nothing gets 'forged' just watching the weeds grow...it takes heat 
>> and
>>   pressure to forge.
>>
>>   Larry
>>   ----- Original Message -----
>>   From: David Utley <mailto:mr.utility@highstream.net>
>>   To: Euroroc II <mailto:flaatr@yahoo.com>
>>   Cc: Scirocco-l@scirocco.org <mailto:Scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
>>   Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2004 12:15 PM
>>   Subject: Re: ebay brake rotors--forging...
>>
>>   LOL...
>>
>>     Yeah, I did learn something interesting about this though...  A 
>> close
>>   friend
>>   went where they make Morgans in England years ago.  He saw in the 
>> back
>> that
>>   they had brake drums and blocks waist-high, piled out in the 
>> open...  He
>>   asked
>>   what was all the waste rubble lying around, and they replied that 
>> those
>> were
>>   new rotors and blocks, aging...  They said that they let them age a
>> minimum
>>   of
>>   two years, then bring them in and machine them for use.  Why?  They
>> actually
>>   forge over time, from the hot-cold of day and night repeated several
>> hundred
>>   times.  That, and this is in England, which has to be one of the 
>> rustiest
>>   (is
>>   that a word?) places in the world...  I thought that was very
>> interesting...
>>
>>     On a side note, most seasoned engine builders prefer to build a 
>> good
>> used
>>   block over a brand new one for this reason.  The number of heat 
>> cycles
>> work
>>   hardens the block...  The one obvious exception to this rule has to 
>> be VW
>>   aircooled blocks.  Ultimately, they should not be reused....
>>
>>   Just food for thought....
>>
>>   Regards,
>>     David Utley
>>   Quoting Euroroc II < flaatr@yahoo.com <mailto:flaatr@yahoo.com> >:
>>
>>> Some one needs to buy these... they're like new!!!
>>>
>>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?
>>   ViewItem&category=33564&item=2465387184
>>>
>>> -Raffi
>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
>>
>>   David Utley
>>   -----------
>>   Cable Volkswagen
>>   405-470-3129
>>   1-800-522-6793
>>
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>
>
>
> David Utley
> -----------
> Cable Volkswagen
> 405-470-3129
> 1-800-522-6793
>
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