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small boost set-up with CIS-E??
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Jeff:
The major issue is I have a T3/T04e and the compressor housing is much =
bigger than a T3 compressor housing and with my tall block ABA the =
compressor is right against the firewall. That is kinda the show =
stopper.
But, mostly it's a bunch of small niggling issues.
The turbine flange isn't a good match to the turbine housing and it's =
only 1/4" thick so there isn't a lot of thread for the NON-metric turbo =
bolts.
The holes for the head exhaust studs are all large (unlike the stock =
manifold that has two small ones) so the manifold isn't accurately =
located on the head and there isn't enough meat in the casting to allow =
me to match port it to my TT ported head.
Last, but not least, the flow path from the #1 cylinder flows smoothly =
from the cylinder, but right at the turbo flange, has a great big =
obstruction. If you could stick your finger inside and feel around you'd =
see what I mean.
It all adds up to a kind of crummy not well thought out product. But, =
I'm an engineer and design machined components day in and day out and =
worry about this kind of stuff.
I've built a quick and dirty log type turbo manifold from weld ells for =
a friend and I think with some work I can build something much better =
that is a little lower profile that will solve my firewall clearance =
issue.
Having said all that, the ATP manifold is a proven piece that will bolt =
on, won't crack, and if you're using a T3 compressor, will not have any =
clearance issues. Plus other ATP parts, like the downpipe, will match =
with it.
So, it's really not junk! It's just that if somebody had paid alittle =
more attention in the design stage it could've been a really nice piece.
Anyway, my turbo install will get a custom fabbed manifold to solve my =
clearance issues. My nephew's turbo install (stock JH with CIS) will =
either get a fabbed manifold like mine or use this piece (unless =
somebody wants to buy it off me for $250+ shipping ;^)
Dan
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Jeff Toomasson=20
To: Dan Bubb ; jesse Neufeld ; scirocco-l@scirocco.org=20
Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 11:56 PM
Subject: Re: small boost set-up with CIS-E??
Dan - your experience with the ATP manifold was bad? What happened?=20
I was actually going to generate an email to the list and Vortex FI =
forum tomorrow night re: what turbo components should I buy new if I had =
the "medium" luxury (i.e., where should I focus my budget).=20
I would have thought a new manifold would be in the top 3 of that =
list...=20
Details, man! Thx, JT=20
Dan Bubb <jdbubb@ix.netcom.com> wrote:=20
Unless there has been some major update to your car it should have =
CIS-lambda, not CIS-E.
From my (perhaps limited) knowledge of turboing a CIS motor this is =
good.
I don't know any prescription for modifying CIS-E for boost, but =
with CIS-lambda the setup seems to be warm up regulator from Volvo 240T =
or Audi 5000T. This should let you run 5 psi from what I've heard. For =
more boost, swap the fuel distributor for one from the Volvo. You can =
use the Audi FD, but need to block off one port!
Check VWVortex Forced Induction forum. Search for CIS in that forum. =
You should come up with most of the info needed.
As a side note, the JH is a pretty good turbo candidate. It may not =
have the oil squirters or turbo pistons of the G60, but the rest is =
pretty much the same. The Hardcore VW guys seem to think it can make 200 =
HP all day. So, if you can get the fuelling and ignition setup right, =
the basic mechanical parts are good to go.
Dan
PS. Welding up your toilet bowl manifold(if you can keep the end =
result from cracking!) will flow just about as well as the POS cast =
manifold from ATP. Just my .02 after buying one which I now intend not =
to use.
----- Original Message -----=20
From: jesse Neufeld=20
To: scirocco-l@scirocco.org=20
Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2003 10:33 PM
Subject: small boost set-up with CIS-E??
hey me and a friend were thinking of doing a small cheap turbo set =
up on his prelude and if it works out good maybe do one on my car in the =
near future.. so my question.. how well will the stock CIS-E fuel system =
on my 84 scirocco fare with about 5psi boost max? will it be sufficiant =
for a turbo set up?
also i have a a1 dual outlet manifold and the stock 4-1 "toilet =
bowl" off my car.. what one would be better to weld up as a turbo =
mani.??
thanks
-84 Kamei body Scirocco
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<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =
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<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2314.1000" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Jeff:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The major issue is I have a T3/T04e and =
the=20
compressor housing is much bigger than a T3 compressor housing and with =
my tall=20
block ABA the compressor is right against the firewall. That is kinda =
the show=20
stopper.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>But, mostly it's a bunch of small =
niggling=20
issues.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The turbine flange isn't a good match =
to the=20
turbine housing and it's only 1/4" thick so there isn't a lot of thread =
for the=20
NON-metric turbo bolts.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The holes for the head exhaust studs =
are all large=20
(unlike the stock manifold that has two small ones) so the manifold =
isn't=20
accurately located on the head and there isn't enough meat in the =
casting to=20
allow me to match port it to my TT ported head.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Last, but not least, the flow path from =
the #1=20
cylinder flows smoothly from the cylinder, but right at the turbo =
flange, has a=20
great big obstruction. If you could stick your finger inside and feel =
around=20
you'd see what I mean.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>It all adds up to a kind of crummy not =
well thought=20
out product. But, I'm an engineer and design machined components day in =
and day=20
out and worry about this kind of stuff.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I've built a quick and dirty log type =
turbo=20
manifold from weld ells for a friend and I think with some work I can =
build=20
something much better that is a little lower profile that will solve my =
firewall=20
clearance issue.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Having said all that, the ATP manifold =
is a proven=20
piece that will bolt on, won't crack, and if you're using a T3 =
compressor, will=20
not have any clearance issues. Plus other ATP parts, like the downpipe, =
will=20
match with it.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>So, it's really not junk! It's just that if somebody had paid =
alittle more=20
attention in the design stage it could've been a really nice =
piece.</DIV>
<DIV>Anyway, my turbo install will get a custom fabbed manifold to solve =
my=20
clearance issues. My nephew's turbo install (stock JH with CIS) will =
either get=20
a fabbed manifold like mine or use this piece (unless somebody wants to =
buy it=20
off me for $250+ shipping ;^)</DIV>
<DIV>Dan</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>----- Original Message ----- </DIV></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: =
0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A href=3D"mailto:jtoomasson@yahoo.com"; =
title=3Djtoomasson@yahoo.com>Jeff=20
Toomasson</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
href=3D"mailto:jdbubb@ix.netcom.com"=20
title=3Djdbubb@ix.netcom.com>Dan Bubb</A> ; <A=20
href=3D"mailto:twitchiban1234@hotmail.com"=20
title=3Dtwitchiban1234@hotmail.com>jesse Neufeld</A> ; <A=20
href=3D"mailto:scirocco-l@scirocco.org"=20
title=3Dscirocco-l@scirocco.org>scirocco-l@scirocco.org</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, March 06, 2003 =
11:56=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: small boost set-up =
with=20
CIS-E??</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<P>Dan - your experience with the ATP manifold was bad? What happened? =
<P>I was actually going to generate an email to the list and Vortex FI =
forum=20
tomorrow night re: what turbo components should I buy new if I had the =
"medium" luxury (i.e., where should I focus my budget).=20
<P>I would have thought a new manifold would be in the top 3 of that =
list...=20
<P>Details, man! Thx, JT=20
<P> <B><I>Dan Bubb <<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:jdbubb@ix.netcom.com";>jdbubb@ix.netcom.com</A>></I></B>=
wrote:=20
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
PADDING-LEFT: 5px">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2314.1000" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Unless there has been some major =
update to your=20
car it should have CIS-lambda, not CIS-E.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>From my (perhaps limited) =
knowledge of=20
turboing a CIS motor this is good.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I don't know any prescription for =
modifying=20
CIS-E for boost, but with CIS-lambda the setup seems to be warm up =
regulator=20
from Volvo 240T or Audi 5000T. This should let you run 5 psi from =
what I've=20
heard. For more boost, swap the fuel distributor for one from the =
Volvo. You=20
can use the Audi FD, but need to block off one port!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Check VWVortex Forced Induction =
forum. Search=20
for CIS in that forum. You should come up with most of the info=20
needed.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>As a side note, the JH is a pretty =
good turbo=20
candidate. It may not have the oil squirters or turbo pistons of the =
G60,=20
but the rest is pretty much the same. The Hardcore VW guys seem to =
think it=20
can make 200 HP all day. So, if you can get the fuelling and =
ignition setup=20
right, the basic mechanical parts are good to go.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Dan</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>PS. Welding up your toilet bowl =
manifold(if you=20
can keep the end result from cracking!) will flow just about as well =
as the=20
POS cast manifold from ATP. Just my .02 after buying one which I now =
intend=20
not to use.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- =
</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A href=3D"mailto:twitchiban1234@hotmail.com"=20
title=3Dtwitchiban1234@hotmail.com>jesse Neufeld</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
href=3D"mailto:scirocco-l@scirocco.org"=20
title=3Dscirocco-l@scirocco.org>scirocco-l@scirocco.org</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, March 05, =
2003 10:33=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> small boost set-up =
with=20
CIS-E??</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<P>hey me and a friend were thinking of doing a small cheap turbo =
set up=20
on his prelude and if it works out good maybe do one on my car in =
the near=20
future.. so my question.. how well will the stock CIS-E fuel =
system on my=20
84 scirocco fare with about 5psi boost max? will it be sufficiant =
for a=20
turbo set up?</P>
<P>also i have a a1 dual outlet manifold and the stock 4-1 "toilet =
bowl"=20
off my car.. what one would be better to weld up as a turbo=20
mani.??<BR>thanks<BR><BR></P>
<DIV>-84 Kamei body Scirocco</DIV>
<DIV></DIV></DIV><BR clear=3Dall>
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