Water pump....questions

[haygood@aemail4u.com (Haygood)]

You guys are missing the point.

Electric turns off instead of pumping against a closed thermostat.  
Electric pumps at the same speed, not oversped by highly revved engine.
Both of these factors mean that it can do the same work more efficiently, not through magic, but by doing the work only when needed.

None of that even matters.  Scotty didn't claim he would increase his overall gas mileage.

What really matters is that when he floors his throttle, he gets more hp.  The above will help with that a good bit, but if he adds the WOT alternator cutout relay, he will simply drop accessory loads at WOT.  Any dinky battery can run all this stuff and more for a good 15 seconds now and then.  

The power advantage is way beyond the minutiae of belt efficiency and the like.

BwH

PS: read up on electric steering racks recently.  Manufacturer's are quoting 4% improvement in power and efficiency.  Mainly it's the decrease in complexity (packaging) they are hyped about.  Just chipping that in.

--- "Chris DeLong" <green536@hotmail.com> wrote:
>The next question Larry, would be the efficiency of an electric pump vs. a 
>belt driven pump. If an electric pump is more efficient than a belt driven 
>pump then how would you consider hp staying the same? power generated by an 
>alternator might be less than that spent on rotating a wp.What you might 
>need to answer is how much wieght is being added by an alternator that is 
>rated at 90A how much wieght is being added to the car to keep a battery 
>that has (how many Ah?) some storage. where does the draw come from and how 
>much load is presented to the engine?
>
>break out with the math.
>
>Now go back to your 75lb. AC removal process to save weight.
>
>i dont think you will win this one buddy.
>
>
>
>Chris DeLong
>ICQ#45030867
>Seattle, WA USA
>'80 16V 'Rocco ragtop
>'91 GLi 2.0 16V (for sale)
>'77 Rabbit 16V
>'61 17 Window type II
>'91 Vanagon
>'84 Jetta
>
>
>
>
>
>>From: "L F" <rocco16v@netzero.net>
>>To: <bhonnold@pac-cap.com>,"'_Scirocco Mailing List'" 
>><scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
>>Subject: Re: Water pump....questions
>>Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 21:12:52 -0800
>>
>>MessageThis is a subject that was VERY recently debated, and this is the 
>>last I have to say on it;
>>You have to be careful when you are considering specialized products like 
>>this, Brian.
>>Every electric water pump in the Summit catalog is listed under "Hardcore 
>>Racing Parts".
>>Look at the advertising for electric water pumps:
>>A Moroso ad says "for drag race use only"
>>Dedenbear's ad says "for drag race use only"
>>One CSI ad says "just for dragsters"
>>A Meziere ad says "oval track, off road, and pulling applications"
>>Those are situations where the electric pump can be powered by an isolated 
>>battery.
>>
>>There's no doubt that replacing the standard water pump with an electric 
>>pump will save horsepower IF (big if) you run that pump off a battery that 
>>isn't being charged by an alternator powered by the same engine. That's 
>>what the sellers base their claims on.
>>Where do you think the energy to power an electric water pump comes from?
>>Answer: a battery.  Where does the energy that's in the street car battery 
>>come from?
>>Answer: the alternator. And where does the energy to spin the alternator 
>>come from?
>>
>>Use of an electric water pump puts three additional devices into the energy 
>>'loop'; the alternator, wiring, and the battery, none of which is 100% 
>>efficient, so it will not save power, ultimately it can only consume 
>>additional power.
>>In a street car, there is only one source of power. One. The engine.
>>In a street car, the engine supplies power for the water pump, either 
>>directly or indirectly.
>>Just stop and think about it for a minute....that's all I ask.
>>No matter who on this list disagrees with me, it won't change the facts.
>>
>>Larry
>>   ----- Original Message -----
>>   From: Brian Honnold
>>   To: '_Scirocco Mailing List'
>>   Sent: Friday, February 28, 2003 5:33 PM
>>   Subject: RE: Water pump....questions
>>
>>
>>   So tell us Larry, exactly why do companies like Moroso, Meizere and 
>>Weiand (sp) waste the time and $$ to produce electric water pumps, and then 
>>go to the trouble of dyno testing cars both with and without those pumps, 
>>in order to advertise that 10+hp is freed up on an chevy motor due to the 
>>reduced drag on the pulley system?
>>
>>
>
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