Re: [Insurance]/SCCA

[Iain Mannix <mannix@secretignition.com>]

At 8:25 PM -0400 08/19/1998, Shawn C Meze wrote:
>On Wed, 19 Aug 1998 09:27:45 -0400 "Brubaker, John" <JBrubaker@AMF.com>
>writes:
>>I made a big mistake today.  I mentioned to my insurance rep that I
>>autocross my car. -snip-
>>Scirocco has now been cancelled from my policy.
>
>
>This is amazingly idiotic.

Agreed.  Some(State Farm, among others) companies insure autocross cars
while competing.  A local autocrosser recently crashed his car on the way
home from the event, and his insurance company called every chief/chair in
the Colorado Region who might say "it happened while competing."  No one
did, as none of us even knew he'd crashed; it surely did not happen at the
event.  What seems reasonable to me is what most companies seem to do -
they'll cover you, but if you roll the car while competing, you're not
covered.  I'm OK with that, personally.

 The insurance companies are so afraid
>something will happen and you will make a claim. As I understand it (your
>region may vary) you are covered by the SCCA's insurance while your out
>on course.

Yes and no - the _competitor_ is covered against bodily harm.  Your car is
_absolutely_ not covered by the SCCA's insurance(Weisenburg Motorsports).
Any SCCA sanctioned event is like this - the vehicle is NOT covered, you
are.  I know of people who have gotten the SCCA's insurance coverage for
bodily harm while at events, and I know of people who have tried to get the
SCCA's insurance to pay for auto damage - if you get hit by a car and get
broken ribs, you're covered insurance wise.  If you flip your car, and you
get hurt, I'm not sure what happens.  I do know the car is your
responsibility(which I agree with; driving at 110% around a parkinglot has
inherent, while small, risks.  If I crash my car, I'll wish I had'nt, but I
won't look to the SCCA to pay for it).


>I believe she had to claim the damage on her own insurance on that one. I
>don't fully understand what's covered by having their own insurance other
>than covering their own asses in the event that something happens where
>people get hurt. Liability only I guess.

Exactly.  I just want to make sure that those who are considering autocross
understand that if they crash their car, the car is their problem!

On that note - for those considering autocross, who are now saying "ROLL my
car?!?  No thanks!," don't worry too much about it.  In the four years I
have been doing this, I have seen two "accidents" resulting in damage.
One, a Miata slid into a curb - the course went somewhat close to the edge
of the lot(but more than the 25' minimum), a Miata overcooked something,
tagged a curb.  I think it bent a control arm.  It was driven home.
Another time, a Miata slid into a signpost, toed the rear wheel in a few
inches, put a sizeable dent into the sheetmetal.  We're not sure how that
happened, almost a year ago, a National Champion type(Renee Eady) was just
carrying a lot of speed into a right sweeper, lost it, slid 80 or so feet
across smooth concrete and tagged the post.  No one hurt, just a drag,
basically.  Oh, twice now, cars have slid across light fixtures at time
trials and "realigned" the car - the light fixtures are about the size of a
large cooking pot's lid, bolted to the concrete - no threat of flipping a
car, but if you hit one just right, it'll knock the alignment out.  I've
never hit one, and that's, oh, speedmath....say, 20 Trials events, 6 runs
each, 120 runs, 40 cars, over about 5000 laps on the trials courses(higher
speeds, basically SoloI).  In that time, 4 or 5 cars have gone farming, IE,
slid into the dirt, no damage to speak of(dirty cars, disconnected wires),
basically, Solo is VERY safe.  I've done more damage to my car driving to
work than I have in the 100 or so runs a year I do.

I've seen one car _almost_ go onto the roof - National Tour last year,
there was a slalom followed by a 90d right hand turn.  I was in grid,
helmet on, sorta following the car through the slalom....brake...right
turnohmygosh that things on two wheels!  It came back down, cool.  Grid guy
points at me, "you, go."  Great.  I know a guy who flipped a GTI once, he
somehow got his insurance company to pay for it, but regardless, the reason
he flipped(and he'd agree) is because he tried to save it repeatedly - out
to the left, countersteer, hook, right, countersteer, hook, etc - until it
develops the momentum needed to go over.  It did.  If the car gets out of
shape, try to catch it - if it hooks and swings back the other way
violently, let it go.  Step on the clutch, start slowing the car down once
it is rolling in a given direction(forward or reverse).  I've spun my car
countless times - most recently Sunday morning - and only once did it
threaten a flip.  It got loose, I tried to catch it a few times, it
eventually slid through a small patch of snow(winter event), hooked up
coming out.  Did'nt feel it go up, sure as heck felt it come down!  Bam.
Learned my lesson - people said the wheels were only 1' or so off the
ground(the Neon I saw was at 45degrees, wheels 4-5' up), but when the car
lets go, I feel it out - if I can't get it gathered in one shot, I let it
go.  I've not seen a car flip at any of our events - it can and does
happen, but basically, the only way I can figure out how to flip a
car(short of hitting something) is to be too persistent - if the car goes
one way, then the other, the run is going to be slow.  Let it spin, get the
spin out of the car's system, take another run.


>Im kind of mixed on whether or not I should come forth with that info. I
>didn't tell my insurance company that I autox, mainly because they didn't
>ask me. I feel I should tell them what I do with the car. But their
>knowledge of what is involved in autoxing is typically so mindlessly
>limited that I feel I should'nt say crap to aviod what happened to you.

I agree - I don't say a word about what I do with my car, just pay the
bill, never make claims, and if I have to, it'll be a reasonable one.  I
fully expect there to be problems if I do get in an accident with the GTI,
however, as it is fairly apparent that its purpose is not that of domestic
duties and shuttling children:).


I.Mannix


--
To subscribe or unsubscribe, send email to scirocco-L-request@scirocco.org,
with your request (subscribe, unsubscribe) in the BODY of the message.

------------------------------