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Gas in the oil, HELP :(
Hi Lexan,
Good to hear you've found the fuel source, now to find out why the
injectors are open.
I think it's got to be one of two options; 1) all 4 injectors are leaky.
Possible, but I'd think they wouldn't all leak at the same rate and
pressure. You can use your beer bottle set up to check (I'm assuming all the
bottles are the same type and volume); just put one injector in each of four
bottles, jumper the fuel pump relay, fill the bottles about 1/2 or 2/3 full.
All the bottles should have the same amount of fuel in them, or damn close.
If this is the case, then I think you can say your injectors are OK. But if
there is a marked difference in the fuel volume in the bottles, then you've
got one or more bad injectors. They're not horribly expensive, so replace
all four.
And option 2), if the injectors are all OK then something is causing the
system pressure to be higher than it should be (above the cut off pressure
of the injectors, about 33psi I think?), thus
all injectors are open and spraying. Sticky plunger in the fuel distributor
block maybe? I'm not going to speculate on how to troubleshoot that, just
read your Bentley. I don't know the history of your car, but if it's been
sitting for a long time (months) it's possible that the fuel has broken
down. Very old fuel can become almost like molasses; thick and gooey and not
at all friendly to precision components such as Bosch CIS. Sounds like you
are getting fuel flow through the entire system, so perhaps using a fuel
cleaning additive might help free the plunger if that's the problem (I've
used BG products in the past and had good experiences, also good is a little
bit of Marvel Mystery Oil in the fuel tank (1/2 quart MMO to 10 gallons
fuel), though this will burn a little blue. You'll need to run a couple more
tanks of untreated fuel before you do an emmisions test.
To use an additive, mix in the correct ratio with about 5 gallons of
fuel, put it in the tank, put all your injectors into some container large
enough to hold 5-8 gallons of fuel, jumper the pump and just let it run
through (don't completely empty the fuel tank, though. Pull out your jumper
when there's still a couple of gallons left in the tank).
Pour the fuel in the container back into the fuel tank, cycle again, and
maybe a couple more times. What you're doing is breaking down gummy
deposits, the gunk will be in small particles in the fuel and not a problem
if not allowed to settle and build up again.
You'll probably need to use a battery charger to keep juice up; be
careful to the point of paranoia about connecting/ disconnecting while
there's open fuel around. Which means don't. Sparks and gas are a dangerous
mix, so be careful and take your time; make sure there's good ventilation,
have a fire extinguisher available (always a good idea when working with
fuel anyway).
So that's that... also you need to deal with current bad situation; fuel
in your oil. I'd suggest flushing the oil system. Drain the old stuff, put
in new (and a filter). Remove the spark plugs and the high tension lead to
the coil, remove the fuel pump relay and/or jumper lead. Now you have no
fuel to the engine, and no spark, and no compression (which makes it easy to
turn over). Crank the starter until the oil pressure idiot light goes out
plus 15-20 seconds. Wait a few mintues for the starter to cool, cycle again.
Do this four or five times and the fresh, uncontaminated oil through the
whole system should have pushed out the fuel traces.
Drain the oil, chnage the filter, refill with fresh oil. Seems wasteful
but oil is cheap compared to overhauling an engine (besides, you're helping
out the economy, right?).
Sort got out of hand, but I hope this helps.
Karl
>From: "Lexan Blanchard" <lexan_122874@hotmail.com>
>To: dan.bubb@gmail.com
>CC: scirocco-l@scirocco.org
>Subject: Re: Gas in the oil, HELP :(
>Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2007 23:51:27 +0000
>
>OK, took some SERIOUS fighting, but I finally got the injectors out, and
>located a jumper wire that could hold a 16 amp fuse (that was a fiasco in
>itself). And, yes, the little O-rings were crispy rings, so that was some
>of the problem.
>
>So, I have discovered a new use for empty beer bottles: injector/cold start
>valve testing areas (man, the things you come up with in desperation)!
>Each injector and CSV got its own bottle so I could tell right away what
>was going on.
>
>As I figured, the CSV is good to go. No gas coming out.
>
>The injectors, on the other hand, ARGHHHHHHH! My mom even said, "Oh,
>you're frustrated, I'll come back later." All 4 sprayed gas when the fuel
>pump was jumped. They spray a beautiful cone-shaped pattern, but they
>shouldn't be spraying.
>
>So, guess this answers the question of why I have fuel in my oil. Now,
>what do you guys recommend? Does this mean I just need to adjust the
>mixture screw? Or do I need to put 4 new injectors on order? Or is this
>something completely different?
>
>Thanks again! Hopefully once this is right and the oil is changed, she
>will start. The fuel that came out of the injectors looked pretty clean
>and smelled like gas, so I may have finished cycling out the old stuff out
>of the lines.
>
>Lexan
>
>
>
>>From: "Dan Bubb" <dan.bubb@gmail.com>
>>To: "Lexan Blanchard" <lexan_122874@hotmail.com>
>>CC: scirocco-l@scirocco.org
>>Subject: Re: Gas in the oil, HELP :(
>>Date: Sun, 18 Mar 2007 07:13:49 -0400
>>
>>Gas in the oil pretty much needs to come from the injectors past the
>>pistons and piston rings, which as you note, isn't good.
>>This is either the cold start injector staying open or the regular
>>injectors injecting too much fuel.
>>What I would do is pull all of the injectors including the cold start
>>injector and aim them all into a pan. Then I'd jumper the fuel pump
>>relay, or if you don't have a jumper cycling the ignition key several
>>times every couple seconds should cause the fuel pump to run for a
>>short period of time for each cycle. Don't crank the engine! Just
>>cycle the ignition off and on.
>>
>>ANY fuel in the pan would indicate a problem. If you're not cranking
>>the cold start injector should not flow any fuel. And neither should
>>the regular injectors since there is no air flowing past the metering
>>plate.
>>
>>If you do have fuel in the pan, then the next step would be to
>>segregate the cold start injector from the regular injectors to
>>isolate where the problem is.
>>If it's the cold start injector then the Bentley has an excellent
>>section on diagnosing that.
>>If it's the regular injectors then it may be as simple as readjusting
>>the mixture screw counterclockwise although if that doesn't do it then
>>the problem would be more serious as Jim mentioned.
>>BTW, all this excess fuel getting pushed past the pistons into the oil
>>may also have the effect of somewhat hydrolocking the engine
>>contributing to your poor cranking performance.
>>Also, as Jim pointed out, it'd be good to change the oil before
>>actually running the engine again.
>>Keep us posted on what you find.
>>Dan
>>
>>On 3/17/07, Lexan Blanchard <lexan_122874@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>Well, winter decided to return today, which ended any ideas I had to
>>>garden,
>>>or clean up the Purple Martin gourds (birds are here and calling me a
>>>slum
>>>lord for not taking care of their residences), so off to retrieve the
>>>Rocco
>>>from the meadow (where she was banned to last week).
>>>
>>>Still trying to finish cycling out the old gas, and figuring I am getting
>>>close. Also, I figured out what went pop-whooosh last weekend (loose
>>>hose
>>>clamp, hehe). Tried starting several times and ran the battery low
>>>(GOTTA
>>>find the short or bad wire, darn it).
>>>
>>>I have noticed a gassy smell every time I try to start, so, figured I
>>>better
>>>poke around a bit. Pulled dipstick (don't ask me why I started here),
>>>and
>>>the "oil" just dripped off. Figured this couldn't be good since when I
>>>looked at it last it was oil. Smells like gas, has consistency of gas
>>>(maybe a bit thicker) and color of fresh oil :( Even with my limited
>>>knowledge, I KNOW this isn't good.
>>>
>>>So, how is this much gas getting into my oil? What is my next step? All
>>>ideas and help are SUPER appreciated, as every day that passes puts her
>>>visit to Cincy less likely.
>>>
>>>Thanks all!
>>>Lexan
>>>'82 8V
>>>
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>>>
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>
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