Re: Removing front swaybar improves handling??

[Shawn C Meze <skerocdriver@juno.com>]

On Tue, 12 Dec 2000 13:47:02 EST WaspHwy@aol.com writes:
>I have bilstein sports and neuspeed sports all around, and heard on 
>the list 
>that removing the front swaybar altogether actually improves handling. 
>can someone explain why?


I saw this thread and so many replies I got all excited thinking I was
gonna jump into a cool flamewar or something. Damn you guys, playing all
nice and stuff!! OK, fine, ill play nice too and try to do my best at
splainin' WTF this no front bar thing is all about. iate? koo. This might
even be more of my "should be in a FAQ section material" or, might be
CRAP! 

Now, keep in the back of your head that not all cars are built exactly
the same, have the same options (Which effects the weight distribution of
the car ) 

This is important because when it comes to tunning your suspension to
handle better, doing the same thing to one scirocco might have different
effects on another. it also depends on what it is your trying to do.
Driving styles differ from person to person. 


NFB:
"No front bar. What does it do? How to make it work for me". 
That's a nice chapter title, isn't it? Heh! 
As its been mentioned, there is a company "Shine Racing Service" or SRS
that does alot of custom road racing VW work. Their solid opinion is that
NO FRONT BAR is the only way to go. They don't care what your doing with
the car, no front bar. Rather arrogant which is why I have a hard time
respecting this attitude of theirs. 
Their system works great for road racing. Why? Simple, they compensate
for the roll stiffness (of the missing roll bar) with stiffer spring's.
REALLY STIFF!! A road racing VW experiences a much different suspension
loading and unloading effect going thru a corner at speed than it does on
a typical autox course. Also the use of a quaife differential is
important to getting the power to the ground which, the no front bar
concept allows the inside wheel to droop enough for it to get power to
the ground. 

What this means to you:

Nothing really. In order to experience the full effect of a NFB
suspension you really need to increase the front spring rates and
probably should have a quaife in the tranny. Or you could be perfectly
content with yanking the stock bar off the car and drive around like Eric
does. it all depends on what it is you want out of the car. 

Now, different sized aftermarket swaybars will give you different
results. Nobody can tell you what setup will ne nuts on perfect for your
car and your driving style. We can tell you what each item could and
should do but the final decisions need to be made by you, the driver. 

Ive gone thru a few different setups on my Autocrosser 82 Scirocco. 

Neuspeed lowering springs / KYB struts  to

Neuspeed Race springs / Koni adjustables to

Neuspeed road race springs / Koni adjustables is currently what's on my
car. 
They're not stiff enough and the shocks need more adjustability for what
im using the car for. 
Swaybars, ive always run the Neuspeed 22mm front and 28mm rear bars. I
also have a stock rear bar installed inverted on the rear axle. Obviously
I needed more rear stiffness which has recently been corrected with
negative camber. I had no idea it would alter the handling so much. (so
much for a compromise of street autox driving setups.) 
Since my 82 is going to be retired from autox duties after the 2001 autox
season, my 79 Scirocco will get all the components plus:
GC coilovers with very stiff springs.
Revalved and double adjustable Koni shocks. 

Oh, and as a bonus, if anyone wants to come out and do some road racing
schooling of their own, Potterman has a heads up on a school in Parumph
Nevada in mid January that I will be instructing at. (Come see me kick
Pottermans ass with a lesser car!!) 
Anyways, its a VW ONLY event in case anyone is interested. I know there
are a few openings left. 
Ill have my FSP Scirocco there with all its swaybars and everything. :)


Shawn Meze
86' Jetta GLi 8V                   84' Scirocco 8V
82' Scirocco GTi -FSP 30-   81' Scirocco<-- FREE to a good home!
The Fastest, Quickest, Cleanest and best looking Scirocco in all of San
Diego!
http://www.Geocities.com/MotorCity/Speedway/1308/index.htm

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