Re: Gear crunch when shifing into 2nd

[SailingFC@aol.com]

I second Jason's comments(below) and I'm living(driving) proof of it.  I've
had my Scirocco from day one(20 years last February) and tried to learn to
shift as smoothly as possible, even when going all out.

When I changed my clutch, during my engine swap at about 100,000 mile, the
factory original clutch had almost as much meat on it still as the Sachs
sports clutch I was putting in.  And I had autocrossed while in school too.

Right now, I'm about to put in a 5-speed and I'm still on my factory original
motor mounts, all four of them.  I do notice my passenger mount starting to
creep forward and has move more noticeably in the last 6 months than it ever
did in the last 19 years.(maybe it's the nitrous)  I will be replacing them
this year when the tranny goes in.

An interesting observation,  I've never had any problems with grinding on any
gear(unless I screw up and declutch to soon) and this thing has 150, 000 plus
miles now.  I also never downshift in order to use the engine to brake
with(why bother, brake technology is so good these days).  When I do
downshift, I try real hard to "heel-toe" or double clutch and get all the
rpm's to match.

It is also interesting to know that my tranny shop told me that any time they
rebuild a VW transmission, they always replace the 2nd and 3rd gear syncros
along with other details and they use sintered metal syncros for a buttery
smooth shift.(I'll soon find out myself)

And Jason, I don't hate you.

Regards to you all and to all a good night.
Long live our Sciroccos!

 -dick-
78 Scirocco
Original Owner
<A HREF="http://members.aol.com/sailingfc/">http://members.aol.com/sailingfc
</A>



In a message dated 9/27/98 5:18:06 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
jason@scirocco.org writes:

> I think Ian hit the nail on the head without even realizing it! :)
>  You could take pretty much any car and grind on the 1-2 shift when it's
cold.
> 
>  The 2nd gear synchro, as Meze said, takes a whole lot of shit; there are a
>  lot of forces acting in there... but Ian made a very important
>  distinction-- when he sifts quickly from 1 to 2 over 3000rpm when the 'box
>  is cold.  That's the problem right there!  Before everything is at normal
>  operating temperature, you should never be revving your engine over 3k to
>  begin with.  In fact, there is a whole different driving style that you
>  should be adopting when your engine is cold.  Pay attention to  some auto
>  transmissions--what happens when they're cold.  They shift at lower points,
>  take much longer to set up the shift, and shift very slowly.  This is
>  exactly what you should be doing to your cars in the morning- don't rev
>  over 3k, don't use more than 1/3 throttle (obviously unless necessary), and
>  make very slow, deliberate shifts.  I have never had a problem with
>  grinding on my transmission-- not in any gear.
>  	I know I am gonna piss a lot of people off with this, but it needs to be
>  said.  Driving a stick is an art form... there is a whole method of what's
>  "right" and what is "wrong".  I was fortunate enough to have lived in
>  Germany during my formative driving years; and was therefore coached on the
>  "right" way to drive a stick and the "wrong" way.  Of course, YMMV, but I
>  think it's safe to say that the Germans know what they're talking about
>  when it comes to cars.
>  	The single most important factor in driving a stick properly is
>  smoothness; and it's not just for the comfort of your passengers; it's for
>  the life of your driveline components.  After x amount of miles driving a
>  certain car, you should be working towards shifting just as smooth as a GM
>  autobox... and there's no reason you should ever feel a shift in your own
>  car.  Being smooth will take the life of your clutch from 80k miles to
>  150k+, but also extend the life of your motor mounts, and help avoid other
>  catastrophic failures due to high loads on the engine and transmission.
>  There's nothing harder on your driveline than a harsh 1-2 shift with the
>  corresponding THUNK and the lurching forward of your passengers' heads.
>  	If you achieve smoothness in shifting, you'll find that you have no
>  grinding problems either.  If you time your shifts to be ultra-smooth,
>  you're essentially shifting at the point where the synchros do nothing; and
>  you don't actually need the clutch at all.  
>  	Sorry for the soapbox speech, but I have been in one too many cars with
>  people who insist they're excellent stickshift drivers (and I'm not talking
>  about anyone on the list) but whose passengers get out with a cramped neck
>  and whiplash... it's bad driving practice and it's killing the cars... and
>  <sniff> it just makes me sad to see these cars being abused like that.
>  	So, folks, now that you all hate me, bottom line; be nice to your car...
>  aim to shift as smoothly as a GM Turbo-Hydramatic, and your car will love
>  you back.  No grinds, no fried motor mounts.  And your passengers will
>  thank you for it! :)
>  		hehe...
>  			Jason
>  
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