[TECH] 3a dyno in and I am disappointed, sorta...

[sad_rocc at yahoo.com (Dan Smith)]

I'm with ya Patrick! I know 16vs make considerably more horsepower and I don't care. I'm sticking with 8v for my swap because it's cheaper, easier and when I get to Cincy next eyar, I want people to know that NA 8v motors can be fast too. Try www.porttuning.com if a P&P job and I often see decent sized cams for sale on Vortex. While I don't have max HP in mind for my engine like you do, my goal is 130hp. Less than that and I'll be very disappointed. Good luck in your quest to find lost horses and way to reprazent da 8v crew! Word up!
 
Dan

ATS - Patrick Bureau <txrocco@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Brian I understand what is the most $$ efficient way to HP producing power
plant, the point I am making by trying to get the most of out of my 8v is.

To prove to myself that I can put out as much HP as I can out of it,
(thinking process of building an air aspired engine is much more challenging
than splapping a turbo (no offence to any self-turboed owner this is not a
bash follow on my mind process) but any kid that owns a rocco 18+ wants to
build a car that will eat Hondas with turbo Vtech.

Personally all I need is to hold off on my speding for a few months and PAY
someone to do it for me.. But that would defeate the purpose of the creative
mind, for example underpulley can provide # amount of HP versus a normal
pulley on a dyno (been done thousands of time, over and over and increase an
turbo engine from 170HP to 185HP..)

But I am talking about, air aspired.. every once counts to get 1 hp...lol
its not about.. My car will beat yours.. heck I can do that with any
american muscle can against any tubo car I know out there on the market..

I have driven the 1/4 miles at 9.2 seconds.. speed is no longer a NEED for
me, I enjoy it... but my mind is basically trying to find a creative way
mechanically to improve a small engine to a very respectable power band, and
if it does not impress anyone that an 8v 's potential can be 140-145HP air
aspired, so be it...

But I'd like to know if I can reach it, because to my knowledge (and I will
admit not knowing it all like Larry does), there is not 300 air aspired car
8v that do that number compared to the number of 1.8/2.0/8v turbo vw that
produce 185HP... and in my eyes, being part of the few, that are "different"
is what gets my adrenaline flowing when I look at my car..

its just me... or I am "old school" sounding tonight ?

ATS - Patrick Bureau - txrocco@sbcglobal.net
----------------------------------------------
MSN:ATSGTX@hotmail.com |YAHOO:ATSGTX@yahoo.com
ICQ:32918816 |AIM:Texasscirocco
----------------------------------------------


=>-----Original Message-----
=>From: Brian McGarvey [mailto:brianm@earendel.org]
=>Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 9:34 PM
=>To: Patrick Bureau
=>Cc: scirocco81@vwmail.net; _Scirocco Mailing List
=>Subject: Re: [TECH] 3a dyno in and I am disappointed, sorta...
=>
=>
=>
=>Trust me patrick,
=>best bang for $$ is a turbo :-).. ask any GRM challenger...
=>
=>BTW a volvo 240T turbo is a T3 63-trim. :-)
=>and that intercooler is HUGE...
=>
=>On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Patrick Bureau wrote:
=>
=>> DAN / POTTER MAN !!!THANK YOU!!! I will do that tonight when I
=>get back from work and tell y'all how it goes. Go spare heads not
=>a problem.. will save cash and get head work done. I think I will
=>just go full blow race setup so that I dont waste tyime with
=>stage 1-2 and just get power. Yep I was impressed with the torque
=>myself, and though low HP levels (in my eyes) the power band was
=>nicely spread. :) gotta love the 8v for that. Now to find a nice
=>Zex NOS setup for it.
=>>
=>> ERIC, you where able to hang with me up to 90 because I was
=>running a 1-7/8 exhaust that leaked, and the car was definatly as
=>tuned as it was now (and that is my excuse and I am sticking to
=>it AHAHAHAH) but if you want to try to stick with me next June,
=>we can try to find that GSR again and I'll spank both of you at
=>the same time then, and just get it out of my system already...
=>(NOS... Vrrrrrooom... Gone.. bue bye.!)
=>>
=>> cash inflow and way too much time at
=>home and work, spending way too much time gawking at power
=>throbbing (grin) mechanical devices.
=>>
=>> I even considered a Supercharger someone is selling on
=>vortex,Jusltron, Milstrom something like that (was a while back
=>and worth 2400$ so I never seriously considred it before)
=>>
=>>
=>>
=>> Eric S wrote:
=>>
=>> This explains why my JH was able to sort of hang with your car
=>Patrick(till about, what, 90?). Only mod on mine is a Kent 278
=>Cam...and I didn't realize many gains from it. Heed the advise
=>that has been given, port and polish that head and it should come
=>alive, as well as Dan said, get your WOT fuel enrichment fixed.
=>The fuel enrichment alone should be a nice easy fix for some HP
=>you missing (as Dan has already said).
=>>
=>> --
=>> Eric
=>> www.VintageWatercooleds.com
=>>
=>> 79 VW Iltis
=>> 81 Scirocco S (*TDI* swap and complete restoration in holding pattern)
=>> 81 Rabbit Truck LX Diesel (FOR SALE!)
=>> 81 Rabbit Truck 2.0 16v Motronic
=>> 83 Scirocco Wolfsburg
=>> 91 Cabriolet (2.0 Crossflow 8v swap and mechanical rebuild in progress)
=>>
=>>
=>>
=>> --- "ATS - Patrick Bureau" wrote:
=>> alright after all my work here is the results I got for my 8v....
=>>
=>> Best run 97.9HP @ 5200 RPM with 118.9 ft torque @ 3100 RPM,
=>dwell set at 60'
=>> and timing at 14' idle, 28' @ 3000 rpm.
=>> Worst paladin7run 93.9HP @5200 RPM with 116.3FT torque @ 2800
=>RPM, dwell set
=>> at 45' and timing at 8' idle, 23' @ 3000 rpm.
=>>
=>> Now I will list my mods to the engine so we can compare apples
=>with apples
=>> and maybe someone can post me their setup and I can figure out
=>where I am
=>> loosing/needing to concentrate my next series of mods/effort to
=>gain more
=>> out of this 8v.
=>>
=>> 3a block, oem specs pistons, rebuild 7K miles ago
=>> JH head with no mods on it
=>> 4-2 manifold, 2-3 eurosport downpipe, to high-flow cat to 2"
=>eurosport cat
=>> back.
=>> G grind Cam
=>> 8lbs flywheel
=>> scirocco 16v knock sensor and box (cis-lambda + knock)
=>> 16v air box intake
=>> OEM scirocco 85 fuel delivery pump and injectors.
=>>
=>> Things to consider;
=>>
=>> JH engine = 75HP(NET) @ 5500 RPM with 100 ft Torque @ 3000 RPM
=>> 3a engine = 108 (NET) @ 5300 RPM with 121 ft Torque @ 3200 RPM
=>>
=>> dyno link ->
=>>
=>>
=>> So basically I am in between them two engines... any thoughts ?
=>and if you
=>> have a dyno image I would like to have them please...(with
=>mods) so I know
=>> where to seek improvements
=>>
=>> ATS - Patrick Bureau - txrocco@sbcglobal.net
=>> ----------------------------------------------
=>> MSN:ATSGTX@hotmail.com |YAHOO:ATSGTX@yahoo.com
=>> ICQ:32918816 |AIM:Texasscirocco
=>> ----------------------------------------------
=>>
=>>
=>> _______________________________________________
=>> Scirocco-l mailing list
=>> Scirocco-l@scirocco.org
=>> http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l
=>>
=>> ATS - Patrick Bureau - txrocco@sbcglobal.net
=>> '85 2.0L Prowler Orange, Kamei X1 Rocco
=>> '84 1.8L Silver Restoration and '83 Rocco Trailer Project
=>>
=>>
=>> _______________________________________________
=>> Scirocco-l mailing list
=>> Scirocco-l@scirocco.org
=>> http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l
=>>
=>
=>--
=>-------------------------------------------------------------
=>Brian
=>88 16v $2004 GRM challenge car http://www.grmotorsports.com
=>84 0v Next years car? mid engine... maybe we'll see
=>82 0v Black 16v kit --parts
=>82 2.0L Topless bunny -- Knock Ignition and bigger clutch. next.
=>90 90q20v doing daily driver duty.
=>91 VFR750F everybody needs a 11-12 sec vehicle.
=>
=>Contact method. Email me for AIM, ICQ, YahooIM, IRC, etc.
=>-------------------------------------------------------------


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