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Re: Breathing air box....
Hey patrick, I can't get into your site. is it down? Anyone else have
any probs?
jeremy
On Friday, November 30, 2001, at 09:12 , Patrick Bureau wrote:
> the address is in the link of the signature below...
>
> Daun: I am on my waym see you tomorow, will call your cell # when I
> cross the border.
>
> ___ ___________
> / |/_ __/ ___/ A Texan's Scirocco 1985 8v
> / /| | / / \__ \ http://www.longcoeur.com/scirocco
> / ___ |/ / ___/ / (AIM) patricdlc, (ICQ) 32918816
> /_/ |_/_/ /____/
>
>
>
> ----Original Message Follows----
> From: Jeremy Salda <roccoguy@mac.com>
> To: "Dan Bubb" <jdbubb@ix.netcom.com>
> CC: scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> Subject: Re: thoughts on breathing - long
> Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2001 12:23:21 -0600
>
> kudos on the swiss-cheese airbox info. i've heard of everyone doing
> that, but when i've sat and thought about it, the same thing came to
> mind, you're going to putting hot air into the engine, not good, unless
> you want to put an intercooler between the box and TB. what's the
> address for patrick's site so that i can see his mod?
>
> jeremy
>
>
> On Friday, November 30, 2001, at 09:54 , Dan Bubb wrote:
>
>> I read an interesting article about the Audi R8 direct injection V8
>> recently
>> in Race Tech magazine. Although the Direct injection engine had up to
>> 35
>> ft-lbs more torque than it's predecesor the drivers all thought the
>> engine
>> had less performance because the power came in sooner so there was less
>> of a
>> hump to the torque curve.
>> The lesson here is that making changes to your engine will make it FEEL
>> faster or slower, but this doesn't necessarily correlate to whether the
>> engine is ACTUALLY faster or slower. The butt dyno is a liar. You have
>> to
>> actually measure to know whether your change was effective or not.
>> Having said that, installing the larger TB will increase power somewhat
>> if
>> done properly by porting the manifold to match it. But, it should
>> really be
>> one of the last things you do to your engine since it will make little
>> difference until you've done all the other stuff i.e. exhaust, cam, P &
>> P,
>> blah, blah. Just installing the TB with no other mods will make the
>> engine
>> feel stronger since you'll be letting in more air for less throttle
>> foot
>> movement, but the full throttle power difference is negligible.
>> Colin at TT once told me that you could have an 8V 2.0 breath through a
>> 1.0"
>> diameter restrictor and it would make no difference in power when I
>> asked
>> him about the exact same mods you are thinking of doing. But, whatever!
>> Feel
>> free to bust your ass for 2 hp!
>> On another note, while everybody's saying how much power they're
>> getting
>> from swiss cheesing their airbox since they're removing that HUGE
>> intake
>> restriction, I'd just like to point out that using the stock intake
>> location
>> (drawing air from the front crossmember) the intake air temp is
>> typically 20
>> deg hotter than ambient. In stop and go traffic it's typically 40-50
>> deg
>> hotter than ambient. Sit parked with your engine running for 5minutes
>> and it
>> will get up to 135 deg! (data from Haltech datalogs) NOW, the message
>> on
>> this is that anybody that thinks drawing air from ANTWHERE in the
>> engine
>> compartment (MY holes are only on the FENDER side!!!) is a benefit is
>> NUTS!
>> The mod that Patrick Bureau has on his website about relocating the
>> inlet to
>> in front of the radiator is the only good input I've seen on this
>> subject.
>> Dan
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Colin <cwass99@home.com>
>> To: <scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
>> Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2001 8:14 PM
>> Subject: thoughts on breathing - long
>>
>>
>>> Hi,
>>> I've been thinking about how to improve my 8v breathing and I
>>> figured
>> I'd
>>> better get opinions before I did something permanent and annoying.
>>> There
>> are 2
>>> basic problems to breathing on my stock CIS system and they each
>>> attach
>>> directly to the air box/fuel distributor assembly. The first is the
>>> teeny
>>> little pipe that lets air in. I removed the nasty little valve that
>>> was
>> there
>>> and re-ran the hose directly from the box to the connection in the
>>> back of
>> the
>>> air dam (yes, it stretched that far without difficulty and stays put).
>>> I was thinking, though, that this needs to be improved upon. My first
>> thought
>>> was to 'swiss cheese' the box, but then I had a better idea. If I
>>> were to
>> get
>>> a 2 inch floor drain and cut an appropriate hole in the bottom of the
>>> box,
>> I
>>> could attach a second pipe and run it to the grill for a bit of a ram
>>> air
>>> effect. Done correctly and carefully, it should look quite neat and
>>> tidy.
>>> I've also considered cutting off the hose connection originally there
>>> and
>>> replacing it with a 3 inch bit of pipe. Again, it should be simple to
>> make
>>> this look quite appropriate. Any thoughts or comments?
>>> The second breathing problem I see needing addressed is the pipe
>>> that
>>> joins the air box to the throttle body. If you look closely, you'll
>> notice
>>> it's somewhat skinnier in the middle than on the ends. I've seen a
>>> couple
>>> advertised replacements for this and they all seem to be based on
>>> somewhat
>>> flattened 3 inch piping with a 48 degree bend on one side to make it
>>> fit.
>> They
>>> also seem to be based on copper pipe. My thought was to use 3 inch
>>> abs
>> pipe.
>>> Does anybody know if this stuff can be bent? I would guess liberal
>>> use of
>> a
>>> propane torch would be helpful here, but I'm open to suggestions. I
>>> think
>>> staying with black abs would look most like the stock piece there now
>> which is
>>> important when you're building a sleeper ;) Besides, I don't have a
>>> pipe
>>> bender that will take 3 inch copper and I don't like the idea of
>>> paying
>> lots of
>>> cash for something I should be able to build myself for under $10.
>>> I see both those things as extremely simple and inexpensive
>>> things
>> that
>>> should improve the air flow into the system substantially. My biggest
>> concern
>>> is that opening up things that much might be more than a basic CIS
>>> system
>> can
>>> stand. I'd appreciate any comments on this.
>>> The whole point of this exercise is to make sure I have decent
>> airflow for
>>> the bigger throttle body I'm going to try and get from the wrecker's
>>> this
>>> week-end. Any thoughts on which TB's I should be looking for? I'm
>>> also
>> going
>>> to try to get a spare intake manifold for my engine to do the carving
>>> on
>> to fit
>>> the new throttle body. Worst case, I go get another and try again
>>> if I
>> screw
>>> it up.
>>> I appreciate any thoughts or comments (except on spelling or
>> grammar...;)).
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Colin
>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
>>
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>
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